UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system
186 points by cdrnsf 11 hours ago | 66 comments
https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2026/05/uk-government-kicks-out-pal...

dust-jacket 2 hours ago
Having spent time working in UK healthcare tech, I never understood why everyone was lining up to throw buckets of money at Palantir. Quite apart from being obviously evil and so on, none of their solutions were actually very good.

Unfortunately, it's hard to escape the feeling that friends in high places, some lobbying and some er... reciprocal back scratching might have been instrumental.

See also senior staff at NHS England (or Digitial? can't remember) handing massive NHS compute contracts to AWS, and then leaving the civil service to become... an AWS employee.

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zipy124 45 minutes ago
The revolving door as it's known. That's part of it. Another is simply the lack of in-house talent, largely due to poor pay and conditions. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy to a certain extent. I'd love to work for NHS digital and make a difference, but all the interesting work is contracted out, so they can't keep the staff who are capable of building themselves. Also the recruitment process is terrible.

Take a look at this job posting for example: https://www.jobs.nhs.uk/candidate/jobadvert/C9175-26-0093 .

The role is more aligned with IT/Data as obvious by the fact that the main skill requirement is SQL.

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dust-jacket 16 minutes ago
Yeah having worked _with_ NHSDigital quite a lot over the years, I would not love to work there!

That said, I don't think there's that much wrong with that job description - I've been a software dev/eng for 15yrs and every role has had SQL at its centre. And its much easier to get someone new up to speed on some swanky new UI or scripting tool than it is with SQL IME, so prioritising people who are comfortable with the hard bits sounds fine to me.

No, wait, I've read it a bit more closely. It's all about Data warehousing. OK yeah, that's a data job.

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regularfry 12 minutes ago
One of the more confusing things is the branding. That job posting isn't for NHS England. Or NHS Digital, which doesn't exist any more.
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mytailorisrich 33 minutes ago
The internal organisation and management of the NHS is horrible.

It is horrible to work for them and in fact in consulting as soon as you hear that the project is for the NHS people run and hide not to be assigned.

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RobotToaster 3 minutes ago
> Unfortunately, it's hard to escape the feeling that friends in high places, some lobbying and some er... reciprocal back scratching might have been instrumental.

I get the same feeling every time I see oracle chosen for anything.

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omcnoe 47 minutes ago
They’ve built a platform and sales pipeline optimized for selling data consulting into highly bureaucratic tech hostile orgs with data privacy concerns. All these factors apply equally to public health programs and the military, so it’s no surprise that they see success in both areas.
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Havoc 37 minutes ago
> never understood why everyone was lining up to throw buckets of money at Palantir.

Same reason the US political system is falling apart - buyable businessmen eh I mean politicians in power. „Lobbying“

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robertkoss 23 minutes ago
Not sure if you have actually used Foundry, but I consider it insanely powerful and well built.
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cryo32 35 minutes ago
The people buying them genuinely don’t know what good is.
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Centigonal 11 hours ago
Palantir is very expensive. This is because:

1. they aim to deliver product company margins with a consulting-heavy model.

2. your software purchase funds a cadre of "free" FDEs and deployment strategists who customize your install, build a bunch of data pipes/transforms, and talk to people to figure out what all the data means.

This could be a good deal if your tech org is not very competent at integrating your data, or if you have a sudden, short-term need. In the longer term, it's probably cheaper and more effective to develop a competent tech team, modernize the source data systems, and roll your own integration -- but that also requires leaders with long-term vision who are resistant to external hype and pressure.

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benj111 3 hours ago
I never understood why nation states pay outside companies for this stuff. You need the expertise to actually evaluate what you're getting anyway. Incentives are in no way aligned. At the state level you have the scale to do it in house.
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Symbiote 2 hours ago
If a senior government employee can get a very expensive Palantir contract approved, they have a good chance of a much better paid job at Palantir in the future:

https://www.thenational.scot/news/26055524.palantir-hired-30...

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maeln 14 minutes ago
This is a paradox that you see in many countries. I work for a private company that make software for the public sector in France, so I am very familiar with the subject. And to be fair, there are many cases where using contractor does make a lot of sense (seasonality or infrequent demands, shared resources, etc). But a lot of the population sees public spending as the biggest evil. This lead to the public sector putting a huge pressure on their biggest spending : payroll. This means fewer employees and worse pay. That makes the public sector not attractive to talent and unable to create a workforce for specific project that should have been fully in control of the public entity. Due to this, the public sector often has to go through private contractor, which ironically often cost more than if you had the skills internally. But increase the number of employee in your municipality and a part of the taxpayers are going to crucify you (somehow they are ok with paying millions to private contractors though). The internal vs. external spending is a difficult one and there is a lot of subtlety to it. Sadly, in the public discourse it is often reduced to "public spending bad" or "everything should be nationalized".
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mike_hearn 2 hours ago
Buy: you need expertise in contracts and knowing what you need.

Build: you need expertise in contracts, knowing what you need and also software development.

It's obviously easier to buy than build, especially for civil service roles where they can't attract the best developers due to political/ideological constraints.

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SXX 2 hours ago
Because "nation states" are not one making decision either. It's done by one specific career bureaucrat or group of them and even best of people who work on such positions usually choose it because of job security and stability.

Spending 10x more on IBM or Palantir can't get them fired, but trying to build something in-house their organization don't have competence for can get them fired.

And this is even if you don't take lobbying or corruption into account.

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InsideOutSanta 2 hours ago
> It's done by one specific career bureaucrat or group

Almost all governments have a legally defined public procurement framework. If this is overridden, it's pretty much always by elected politicians, not by regular government employees.

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SXX 54 minutes ago

  > Almost all governments have a legally defined public procurement framework.
These frameworks are all created and administered by same career bureaucrats.

  > If this is overridden, it's pretty much always by elected politicians, not by regular government employees.
Why they need to overridden in first place? Using of consultancy services is not usually banned.

Also it's not like 4 years ago either UK or EU governments would expect they will soon want to get rid of all US companies in their public sector.

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pjc50 38 minutes ago
Yes, and: often they're prevented from building it in house!
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SXX 22 minutes ago
In some countries yeah. In UK almost all of gov.uk even hosted on github with public commit history.

But its kind a obvious why some system for refugees was outsourced for consultancy.

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xyzzy123 12 minutes ago
If you get someone else to do it you are not responsible for failure.
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pjc50 37 minutes ago
See my comment on the AI replacing consultants story: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48133728
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esperent 2 hours ago
Plausible deniability. "We paid £5 million for consultants who recommended this system, it's not our fault it turned out to be a steaming pile of crap that wasted £20 million and took 3 years".
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nielsbot 2 hours ago
if Palantir (or other consultancies) are friends with government decision makers (especially in the US) then spending more on a service is a feature, not a bug.
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logotype 3 hours ago
reads like Salesforce to me, ugh! Enterprises are paying so much to blatantly vendor-lock in themselves using hundreds of "Salesforce engineers". It's baffling to me.
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ivan_gammel 3 hours ago
I owned Salesforce setup with 4 engineers and 500+ licenses. I don‘t see how could I replace our SF setup with an in-house product on the same budget within reasonable timeline. We won local competition within a few years, because our sales could use good CRM from day 1 and our competitor, according to the rumors I heard, could not calculate properly sales agent commission. Vendor lock-in is not always a stupid thing. Sometimes it‘s the bet that wins you a market.
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collabs 2 hours ago
Zoom out a little though. I've always felt the main reason That most companies use Salesforce Is that most companies use Salesforce.

I'll give you an example. At a previous employer, We used Google Analytics. We paid for Google Analytics. I feel positive that as a mid size company, We shouldn't have paid for Google Analytics. The free product with 50 events in GA4 should be plenty for us. But why do we use Google Analytics in the first place? Because everyone uses Google Analytics.

I agree that sometimes Salesforce might be a good idea. However, it should be a part of an overall strategy, not just because everyone does it. This kind of deliberate tooling strategy is difficult though because the way Google Analytics or Salesforce works from what I understand is make marketing folks feel they are specialized in Google Analytics or Salesforce so they feel like they have to keep using it or their skill will become useless.

It is like resume driven development but for the whole business.

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ivan_gammel 2 hours ago
I think it‘s kind of a common knowledge now that Salesforce is very expensive, so it is not a go-to choice for most startups/no-CRM-experience people. You are more likely to start with Hubspot today than with anything else, but those low-effort CRMs are also quite easy to migrate from. Google Analytics too, so it’s not exactly a „lock-in“. The lock-in happens when you struggle with your current setup or risks associated with it become unacceptable, but do not have the budget and a competent team or external partner to execute the migration.

„Everyone does that“ is definitely part of decision-making process almost everywhere, but I personally have not seen companies where it’s just a cargo cult rather than a reasonable strategic choice. The obvious benefits are that it’s easier to find implementation partners, the costs are predictable and your users may already know the system, so you won’t have unnecessary friction in your ops.

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harry8 10 hours ago
could palantir consulting be replaced by LLM in the hands of a half competent hacker?
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hx8 10 hours ago
No.

1. Palantir isn't selling consulting as much as Palantir is selling the confidence you get from buying a name brand. It's the same as paying for McKinsey to provide justification to do what you already want to do.

2. Palantir actually has some good core tech. An in house team can probably do a better job just because the incentives are better aligned, but they'll be starting from behind and have to catch up.

3. LLMs aren't at a level to replace a team of FDEs. Maybe in a couple of years. The role requires too much understanding of the human systems, and too much initiative to keep the ball rolling/acknowledge and deal with real problems.

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refs 9 hours ago
Its much easier to replicate a thing that already exists and has had many sunk expenditures incurred.
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ozgrakkurt 3 hours ago
Seriously what did LLMs replace or can replace? You are living in a world of dreams
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fragmede 10 hours ago
No one got fired for buying ~IBM~ Palantir. (Well...)
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stuaxo 11 hours ago
"In a 2023 blog post, external, Palantir described the challenge of combining data from multiple government systems containing tens of thousands of visa applications and hundreds of thousands of accommodation offers."

This is the kind of thing GDS and other Civil Service departments build all the time, its a completely standard kind of challenge that a small team of Devs (+ supporting staff) from a departments DDAT department does day in and day out.

The output will be open source by default and use existing standards.

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InsideOutSanta 2 hours ago
Yeah, this exactly. "multiple government systems", "tens of thousands", "hundreds of thousands" is the typical "part-time allocation for four people in an office" government project. This should have a budget in the low hundreds of thousands of £ at most.
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vkou 11 hours ago
Hundreds of thousands of documents is small enough that you can feasibly run a pen and paper office handling them. Especially since most of them do not cross-reference eachother (family applications do, but unrelated families have no such links).

That America's brightest tech minds can't solve this problem is embarrassing. (Never mind the baggage of giving a foreign, potentially adversarial nation access to something as sensitive as residency and visa information.)

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jimbokun 10 hours ago
This article is about the UK.
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MikeTheGreat 10 hours ago
I assumed that when the GP said the UK was "giving a foreign, potentially adversarial nation access" the GP meant that the US is that "foreign, potentially adversarial nation"

I can't believe that in our timeline Europe has to think like this, but here we are.

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vkou 10 hours ago
I'm well aware.

Note that Palantir is an American company that failed to solve this problem well, and introduces an adversarial risk to the UK.

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PunchyHamster 11 hours ago
Could probably be moderately complex excel sheet. Well, hopefully not but keeping that one guy that know how it works is still cheaper than Palantir!
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marysol5 2 hours ago
They did that with the COVID19 tracker.

And ran out of rows

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-54423988

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simonsarris 11 hours ago
There's not really enough info to know if this is just a coin toss or something more. "Company tries to roll its own system and [saves / loses] money" is just a common story, one way or the other.

For context, the Homes for Ukraine refugee scheme cost 2-3 billion as of 2023. I can't seem to find an updated cost. This cost (from the article) was Palantir working for free for the first 6 months (could they have beat that, time wise?), then awarded 4.5m and 5.5m for two more 12 month terms, and now they're transitioning to something home-grown instead.

> The MHCLG [ Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government] said it initially needed a system which could be ready within days but, in seeking a "steadier service", later created an updated platform to meet the programme's longer-term needs and bring down costs.

I basically agree with the MHCLG's reasoning here. It's always worth at least experimenting to see if you can roll your own.

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ownagefool 2 hours ago
I worked on a small part of one of these back in around 2013 ( specifically managing beds ).

You were talking about a team of 5 cranking this out in about 2-3 months with some longer term part time involvement, with an annual cost of less than 1m and those people mostly all dellivering several product lines ( so actual cost is half or a quater ).

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InsideOutSanta 2 hours ago
> "Company tries to roll its own system and [saves / loses] money" is just a common story, one way or the other.

Governments build these kinds of systems ("collect data from a bunch of internal systems and show some public forms and have some internal processes for handling form submissions") all the time. When I worked for a local municipality, we built something like this every other month.

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stuaxo 11 hours ago
GDS has a framework that UK Gov departments have been following for some time to build sites with similar challenges to this for some time.
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kloop 10 hours ago
> There's not really enough info to know if this is just a coin toss or something more.

The difference is always having one or two devs who care. Every successful software project I've ever seen has had a few devs who care way more than is healthy

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rozab 2 hours ago
My parents took in a Ukrainian family as part of this scheme, and I knew many others who did. They all matched with each other through Facebook groups set up for this purpose. I don't know anyone who was matched automatically by the Palantir thing
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UrbanNorminal 9 minutes ago
Seriously how does a sane government official trust Palantir of all companies with their data.
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RealCodingOtaku 3 hours ago
The contract with NHS is about 300 mil, public don't want it, most GPs don't want it, so let's drop that next.
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ChrisRR 2 hours ago
Developing a replacement system is still going to cost a hell of a lot. It's not like if you dropped palatir then we'd suddenly have a free drop-in replacement and everyone can have their fiver back
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flr03 46 minutes ago
You pay money to Palantir that money essentially escapes the economy, you develop a sovereign solution yes you pay millions even more but that goes into corporations and people actually living in the country, paying taxes and spending their coins here.
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razakel 33 minutes ago
When they first rolled out Universal Credit, they decided to do it using Microsoft Dynamics NAV.

It didn't work very well, so GDS rebuilt it in-house.

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angulardragon03 11 hours ago
The MHCLG blog post that this article is reporting on is available here: https://mhclgdigital.blog.gov.uk/2026/04/09/from-emergency-t...
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qweiopqweiop 57 minutes ago
Honestly, a web app to match people looking for and willing to provide accommodation is completely different to dealing with the health data of an entire country that is pre-existing in different formats. The first is essentially a CRUD app that should never have been given to Palantir.
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spwa4 30 minutes ago
The reason for Palantir at the NHS, the problem they're trying to solve is this:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1388245/uk-sick-leave-fi...

Now, I get it. The UK is not exactly providing good jobs for a lot of people, so of course we're seeing this. But, getting a mental health diagnosis, be long-term-sick and avoiding unemployment while both getting paid by an employer and getting unfair advantages out of the public health system ...

In the UK, long term sick leave with a mental health diagnosis is a way to be unemployed (ie. not working) but not have the disadvantages of that. There's the money difference: 530 pounds per month for sick leave, 338 or 425 pounds per month for unemployment. On long-term sick leave you get all advantages job seekers get (ie. "Universal Credit"), PLUS others (support for not being able to work, ESA, and support for extra living expenses due to long-term sickness, PIP). So if you don't want to work, long-term sick leave has many advantages (you can even put that you're working on your CV), plus it's a big cost to employers. You don't have to look for work in long-term sick leave. In fact, nothing is expected at all (other than medical evidence).

2.8 million people are long-term ill, not participating in the workforce, not being economically productive at all, at least half due to being diagnosed with mental illness. The issue with this is that this is happening with full support of government employees, and even the courts cooperate to a lesser extent.

What the government is trying to do, in other words, is trying to kick people off, uh, let's say "mental disability", force them to work. And they need to do this without relying on government workers, because they often side with the people on sick leave.

Hence, Palantir. Being hated is a feature here, not a bug.

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regularfry 4 minutes ago
> The issue with this is that this is happening with full support of government employees, and even the courts cooperate to a lesser extent.

Why is that an issue? The simplest explanation is that the underlying rate of mental illness is inconveniently high. Which would tally with, as you say:

> In fact, nothing is expected at all (other than medical evidence).

Also I would take a look at the date when the upcurve starts on that chart and ask myself: was there some sort of mass disabling event that happened about then? Might that be contributing?

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oldfuture 3 hours ago
well, I mean their goals are kind of clear https://newrepublic.com/post/207693/palantir-ceo-karp-disrup...
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freakynit 3 hours ago
Palantir is not just analyzing data, but, it is increasingly wired into operational decisions like deportations, policing, health-data access, military targeting and public-sector workflows.

Tjheir "ELITE" guide says that during "special operations" normal safeguards may need to be turned off.

Palantir's Maven Smart System ha grown into a Pentagon program of record with 20,000+ active users. "Human in the loop" may become "human rubber stamp" when the number and speed of AI recommendations exceed real human review capacity.

A Palantir-backed program reportedly operated secretly from city council members, defense attorneys, and the public.

Vendor lock-in issue: once a system becomes embedded in agency workflows, switching vendors becomes politically and operationally hard and they are trying their best to achieve this. The Army's $10 billion enterprise agreement consolidating many contracts into one Palantir platform is the cleanest example of institutional dependence.

--- tldr;

The accountability chain is broken: when harm happens, the agency blames the tool, the vendor blames the customer, the operator blames policy, and the model blames the data.

---

Also, I won't share the full report link since whenever I share something like that here, I get banned/flagged for a day.

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freakynit 3 hours ago
... Continuing with a few important numbers...

1. ICE awarded Palantir a reported $30 million contract for ImmigrationOS, described as a platform to support immigration lifecycle operations, including enforcement prioritization and self-deportation tracking.

2. Palantir’s Maven Smart System was designated a Pentagon ‘program of record’ in March 2026, with 20,000+ active military users and a contract ceiling that grew from $480 million to $1.3 billion.

3. The US Army’s $10 billion enterprise agreement consolidates 75 separate contracts into one Palantir platform.

4. The Maven Smart System has 20,000+ military users across 35+ military tools.

5. The UK NHS Federated Data Platform, valued at £330 million ($448.4 million), places Palantir at the center of England’s health-data architecture.

6. Palantir’s UK public contracts across NHS, Ministry of Defence, councils, and police forces total more than £500 million.

7. NHS England’s Data Protection Impact Assessment documents 15 inherent risks, all assessed as ‘Low’ residual risk after mitigations.

8. The NHS FDP contract was published with 417 of 586 pages redacted.

9. Palantir received more than $113 million in federal spending since Trump took office, plus a $795 million Pentagon contract.

10. Polling cited by The Guardian indicates more than two-thirds of the UK public are concerned about Palantir’s growing number of public contracts, and 40% distrust Palantir specifically regarding NHS patient data.

11. From detection to ‘prosecution’ (killing), ‘no more than two or three minutes elapse’ with Palantir systems, compared to six hours previously.

12. Palantir’s lobbying spending more than quadrupled since 2019, from $1.4 million to $5.8 million.

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sandman83 2 hours ago
hopefully a similar route is taken with regards to NHS too.
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jimbokun 10 hours ago
I would imagine with AI generated software this kind of replacing off the shelf software with internally created software will only increase.
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spiderfarmer 11 hours ago
Palantir needs to be banned in every EU country. The UK would be wise to do the same.

I would never trust an openly MAGA company.

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marysol5 2 hours ago
That "Press Release" they put out with echos of Nazi Germany should have been enough for anyone
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scoot 10 hours ago
Millions of pounds wasted by using Palantir tech in refugee system

(FTFY)

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jdw64 3 hours ago
Palantir’s roots seem practically indistinguishable from the traditional Korean/Japanese dispatch programmers (often referred to as SI, or System Integration). They dispatch engineers under the title of FDSEs, but in Korea and Japan, this kind of on-site deployment is often considered the lowest tier of programming.

In my own experience consulting with factory owners—advising them on hardware choices like Lumens versus Mitsubishi—I see the physical reality. The idea of absorbing a client's database into an ontology and hooking it up to an LLM sounds great in theory. However, considering the extreme fragmentation of equipment standards and data representations across different sites, I seriously question if this is a sustainable business model.

Sure, initially it’s just dispatch programming. But how can they possibly absorb all these disparate, chaotic field environments into a single platform asset? Even within a single factory, different assembly lines use entirely different equipment, often from completely different manufacturers.

The idea of interpreting every piece of equipment's specific protocol, reverse-engineering the DB schemas, standardizing the terminology, and modeling the entire approval flow seems practically impossible. Is this actually achievable? Take PLCs, for example: even if they share a standard communication protocol, the ladder logic itself is completely incompatible across different brands

Thinking about it in reverse, Palantir might have absolutely no intention of solving this fragmentation problem themselves. Their survival strategy might be to dictate the core tech stack of the end-point B2C clients, creating a structure that essentially incentivizes specific B2B vendors to fall in line. Ultimately, what makes Palantir so dangerous is the high likelihood that they will simply shift the massive cost of standardization onto those B2B subcontractors

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