Inkling 2 Small
174 points by Philpax 8 hours ago | 60 comments
epsteingpt 7 hours ago
It's a nice, domestic open weight model.
replyWithout hundreds of millions in 9 days a small team is producing a model that can beat DeepSeek 4.1 and a platform to tune it.
Optimistic for the future.
alexandra_au 27 minutes ago
It doesn't beat DS v4.1, and they have so much more compute capacity than any Chinese company, yet still cannot even beat MiniMax M3.1 Flash (220B) despite having 2.7x more parameters (596B).
replyexplosion-s 5 hours ago
Correctly if I’m wrong but isn’t inkling made by a very well funded startup from an ex - OpenAI exec iirc?
replyarcticbull 4 hours ago
Yes, Mira Murati's Thinking Machines. They are apparently trying to raise $5B at $40B, after raising $2B at $10B last year.
replylifeisloving 5 hours ago
If you cant beat Deepseek on price im not using it. I actually dont care about beating DS in capabilities, I dont think you need more intelligence than Deepseek for 99% of the things people work on, and I dont want LLMs to do everything, that kind of defeats the point. I just need a smart fuzzer and to offload some tedious busy work.
replySo why should I pay for 3-20x more for a few small percentage points in preformance. (I would prefer DS did some things better, but largely I can force my desired behavior), but I could only have access to Deepseek 4.1 and still beat almost everyone using opus/fable/astra on a productivity basis, I need automation tools not "do my entire job so Im worthless tools", and DS has already more than gotten there for me.
itkovian_ 5 hours ago
The most important thing here is training was entirely nvfp4 - this is best model by far that has ever been trained in that precision and explains why they were able to do it so fast
replya11r 7 hours ago
Very refreshing to see benchmarks where the reporting team is not the clear winner. They are claiming to be better than GLM 5.3 flash, which is impressive if it holds up outside of benchmarks.
replytcdent 8 hours ago
Is it SOTA yet? No. Are the domestic open weights labs demonstrating incredible velocity? Undeniably.
replybensyverson 4 hours ago
Seems to be pretty close to SOTA on design. I’m excited to try it out with my agentic design system.
replybashtoni 8 hours ago
Distillation is the tide that lifts all boats
replyepsteingpt 7 hours ago
Imagine if Mira Murati and John Schulman actually know what they're doing?
replysyntaxing 7 hours ago
I can’t seem to find the cost? The craziness of deepseek flash 1017 is how ridiculously cheap it is for how capable it is.
replyygouzerh 2 hours ago
Interesting, I sent the same wine testing example to Claude Opus 5.5 medium, and it failed, where Inkling 2 Small succeed.
replyddxv 7 hours ago
This is amazing! Can't wait to trying this out. Also, crazy that I found this on LinkedIn with more upvotes and discussion than the HN thread has.
replyNeywiny 6 hours ago
I feel like this is a dumb question, but why are we spending any effort on wine comparisons? Is there a way to get rid of experts on these to just be ones for code?
replyXenophileJKO 4 hours ago
Just looking through the benchmarks, the model seems to be very high on visual/spatial capabilities. So I assumed they just tried some hard tasks on it and was surprised by wine identification and thought it was surprising that it could identify wines.
replykccqzy 6 hours ago
What if your coding project is related to wine? So you would want facts about wine to be inside the weights, not through web search.
replyrandomblock1 5 hours ago
It's not like they're training on that. That's just a good showcase of how the model is good at generalizing & understanding (not benchmaxxed). You might want something similar to these experts for tasks like detecting anomalies or discoloration or whatever.
replyalexandra_au 4 hours ago
Damn their last "Inkling Small" model was only 266B and now this is more than double.
replylostmsu 7 hours ago
> Small: 594 billion parameters
replycries in GPU racks
colingauvin 7 hours ago
You could probably run a Q2-Q3 with 2x DGX Sparks. So...$12k at today's prices. Plenty of folks are running DS 4.1 Flash with Strata and some GPU + bulk in system memory. Maybe more like $3k-$4k? But speeds come down quite a bit.
replyjazzyjackson 7 hours ago
I don’t like it. Poor form to squat on an old companies name like that, one which has a rich legacy in AI. I know the trademark was cancelled so all I can say is I don’t like it.
replysingpolyma3 7 hours ago
So basically comparable to DS4.1? But why bother to make something we already have?
replynullbio 29 minutes ago
I would hope that the American models aren't benchmaxxed to hell like all of the Chinese ones are.
replymultisport 6 hours ago
Because its american.
replysingpolyma3 6 hours ago
lol
replyreasonableklout 6 hours ago
Sovereign open source AI is a real thing, lots of companies want to own their own intelligence but also don't trust the models coming out of China.
replysingpolyma3 5 hours ago
Why would you trust anything coming out of USA?
replyestearum 5 hours ago
The vast majority of users on this website wouldn't be trusting something coming out of the USA, they'd be trusting something in the USA.
replynozzlegear 4 hours ago
Do you mean to ask why non-American companies would trust anything coming out of the USA? Because American companies tend to have a lot of trust for other American companies.
reply
Open weight US based Opus 5.5 within 12 months.
(I am assuming Inception is an American company, not sure TBH)
My read on Diffusion LLMs has been that it's cool tech, but only useful for things like like code autocomplete or editing a block of text.
They don't beat autoregressive models on quality per compute, assuming you are serving lots of users and can batch requests.
but to your point , yeah diffusion models can be kind of brain dead without proper coaxing.
my ideal arrangement is a smarter/bigger model supervising lots of proposals from diffusion models. The diffusion models spit out a big proposal each, the bigger model can vet something as minor as the headline or filename for each proposal, time still ends up being saved.
Seems unlikely. Maybe open weight at all near there? That'd be great.
Frontier and open weights? Yes.
Frontier and _US_ open weights? No.
I'd expect a US open weights provider to suddenly get bought or go non-open if they get near Opus 5.5 anyway.
I'm not saying that any of them are to the level as a deepseek v4.1 flash 1017 or similar but they're catching up. The most recent huge mistral release is also grounds for an optimistic view.